Saturday, August 29, 2009

Healing evangelists

Just a reminder of the healing service tonight at Wilson park at 6:30. Healing has been a controversial matter for years, in secular as well as religious circles.
But, I found that years ago, another healer came through Arkansas City.
She was a nationally known evangelist.
AIMEE SEMPLE McPHERSON was a pentacostal preacher in the 1920s. She conducted massive healing services across the country and was a pioneer in the pentacostal style of preaching. She was controversial at the time, but her meetings drew thousands of people. She held meetings for a month in Wichita, in 1922, and many people were healed, including several from Arkansas City. People in Arkansas City were so impressed they invited her to come here.
It is estimated that 5,000 people crowded into Wilson Park to hear her speak and watch her heal people. It was reported in the newspaper that a storm was stopped by her prayer.
There were long reports about her in the local newspapers. There were reports about her meetings in Wichita, as well as reports about arranging for her visit, as well as a long report of the visit itself. A Traveler Sports Writer was healed.
This was in May of 1922
You can read the entire newspaper account here:
http://www.arkcityrevived.com/CHURCH/AIMEE_SEMPLE_McPHERSON.html

(If this link does not work, please try again later. There is an issue with the server.)
An aside, the journalist in me marveled at the reporting. Certainly a different style. The detail was pretty amazing. Im no sure how many papers would print such a thing objectively today.
I do like the way papers were written back in the old days.
As Larry Norman once said. "sometimes i think we have advanced, but then i look at where we are."

33 comments:

  1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7BQKu0YP8Y&feature=PlayList&p=BFFBC511994F470D&index=6

    People that prey on the weakest and most desperate among us for monetary gain are scum.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Awesome newspaper account. It's a shame the church cannot get the same respect today. Personally, I know my God, and my Lord is a 'Healer'!

    ReplyDelete
  3. What's the matter with you James? that person had you on the ropes so you just delete everything both of you said in the debate? I am a Christian, and I was on your side, and I was enjoying the back and forth, but that was a chicken s--- thing for you to do. I hope you are ashamed of yourself. Censorship to win a debate. you sound like Obama.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Hi Ava.
    I felt he was just dismissing anything i said, and kept saying i was an idiot no matter what i said. I know that no matter what evidence I would present, he would just dismiss it ... that isnt debate.
    Actually, i thought i was foolish for even getting involved. It was not a good debate.
    How did that person have me on the ropes?
    He did not disprove anything I said. His only response to anyting i said was "that isnt true.", or "youre an idiot"
    I dont that is exactly a refutation.
    I was giving sources, dates, quotes.
    He was just saying "that isnt true."
    He offered absolutely no evidence to support his claims. There must be basic intellectual honestly to have any kind of debate.
    Maybe I should not have deleted it, but it was just so predictable.
    I would love to debate anyone who is really interested in debates.
    But I am not going to be called names and have everything i say dismissed as stupidity.
    He was not interested in debate. He was just interested in trying to cause confusion.

    ReplyDelete
  5. It's easy for you to say that's all it was. I can't show you now because you deleted it, but if I remember right, he showed bible verses for everything. I don't remember any names being called either. I still think it was chickens---. Like I said, I am a Christian, but I am open to other views than just my own. you don't seem to be. It's either your way or the hiway. I have lurked here quite awhile without commenting, but this made me mad. You made my first post a bad one with your actions.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Hey, thanks Ava. It's nice to know some people are open to other views than their own.

    And you're right, I did present bible scriptures to back up what I was saying, and I didn't call him any names. Well, I did say he was a crazy person when he said there was more proof that Jesus existed than George Washington. I certainly never used the word "idiot" like he said I did.

    I think he deleted the thread because he didn't like having it out there for everyone to see.

    Now he can just make up stuff about what each of us said and no one will know the truth. Except you, of course. I'm glad you were tuning in and caught it though. I hope others see how he is when things don't go his way.

    ReplyDelete
  7. I was trying to have a civilized discussion with you.
    I even offered to meet with you to discuss issues.
    You would not even respond to evidence I presented except to say it didnt exist.
    What, do i have to go to the National Museum of Antiquities in Egypt and steal scrolls and bring them to your house and show you. You would probably deny that too.

    Sorry if i got aggravated. You were baiting me and I took the bait.
    I am open to other peoples views, and I let them express them here a lot.
    You are the one that is intollerant.
    I present evidence, with footnotes, you just say it doesnt exist ... what kind of debate is that?

    You did give some bible verses. All out of context and twisted around.
    The bible does not say the Sun rotates around the earth. A poem referring to the sun setting is not saying that.

    ReplyDelete
  8. I guess we'll never know what really happened, or what evidence either of you had, since you took the cowards way out and deleted it all. I guess it's your blog, so you can be the dictator huh.

    ReplyDelete
  9. Speaking of cowards. I see you signed your name.
    Pretty brave.
    Oh wait, you didnt sign your name.

    ReplyDelete
  10. You guys should know if you've been reading this blog that JJ censors stuff that he doesn't like.

    And Booby Dylan, I'm sure that's your given name, right? lol "Hi Kettle, you're black!" -Pot

    ReplyDelete
  11. I thought DAS's blog was bad about censoring, but this takes the cake.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Yea, Im just the worse censor in the world i guess.
    I just wont let anyone talk about anything.
    But ive learned.
    Its ok for you guys to insult me, but not ok for me to even question you, on my own blog.
    I see.
    I get it now.

    If you want to have a real debate, use yoru own ideas. The stuff you were posting was copied and pasted from atheist websites.

    I really doubt anyone cares other than you.

    ReplyDelete
  13. I am reading this for the first time, and I do care about censorship in all it's forms. Censorship to win a debate is disgusting, and shows your true colors. Shame on you James Jordan. You should know better. Journalists are supposed to champion free speech, not squash it. It sounds like this guy really got under your skin. I wish I would have gotten here sooner.

    ReplyDelete
  14. I think you guys are way overreacting. 99 percent of my readers think i am very open to letting people post what they want.
    Maybe i did get aggravated a little. But I dont think i should be expected to let people copy and paste propaganda here from other web sites.

    ReplyDelete
  15. So copy and paste from the Holy Bible is unacceptable? I see.

    And who are you kidding, you don't even have 99 readers, so if four or five think you're wrong, that's more than one percent.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Oh man. I got a text about this and had to come see for myself. Looks like JJ is up to his old ways again. It's like he never left the Traveler! I forwarded the text along, so this is making the rounds around town. It's pretty sad that you resort to censorship because you are losing a debate. I'd love to see the original posts. Does anyone know how we can find them?

    ReplyDelete
  17. Dude, that is not a good way to win a debate.

    ReplyDelete
  18. But its cool to anonymously blast the blog owner.

    ReplyDelete
  19. So 6:42, you support censorship such as was practiced here? To win a debate you just erase everything your opponent says and say they said things they didn't?

    ReplyDelete
  20. the Atheist in the roomSeptember 8, 2009 at 4:55 PM

    "I felt he was just dismissing anything i said, and kept saying i was an idiot no matter what i said. I know that no matter what evidence I would present, he would just dismiss it ...

    He did not disprove anything I said. His only response to anyting i said was "that isnt true.", or "youre an idiot"
    I dont that is exactly a refutation."


    That is not true and you know it. I never once called you an idiot. I hope you are proud of yourself for losing a debate, then erasing it, and THEN lying about what I said. What a hypocrite. It's "christians" like you that make me an atheist.

    ReplyDelete
  21. I refuted everything you posted, and you just dismissed it. You would not admit the evidence I posted was evidence.
    That was the problem.
    I know you copied and pasted everything you had from a website ... i looked around about 20 seconds on google and found it all.
    GO ahead and copy and paste it again, and ill refute it so you can say i just believe things blindly.
    This is my blog. I dont have to allow anything I dont want on here.
    But just look at what all ive let you say about me.
    How many atheist sites will let me come and post arguments that actually have evidence behind them?

    ReplyDelete
  22. So sad. You had no evidence. Prove what you are saying. I refuted everything you posted. Josephus being chief among your evidence.

    You're right, it's your blog. You can go on posting lies about what I said and make yourself out to be the conquering hero, but we both know you took the cowards way out and then lied to the other people who called you on it, and you will have to live with that on your conscience. The difference between you and I is that I have morals based on doing what is right, not on some book of fables.

    I bet any atheist website would allow you to post any of your ridiculous evidence, and then they would wipe the floor with you. Atheists know more about the bible than most christians. That's why they are atheists... because your bible makes no sense.

    Here are a couple you can start with

    http://www.rationalresponders.com/

    http://ffrf.org/

    http://www.atheists.org/

    Knock yourself out. If any of them refuse to let you have your say, as you did me, then I will eat your hat. They may refute your so called evidence and make you look like a fool, but they will let you have your say. They don't fear debate as you clearly do.

    ReplyDelete
  23. You say Josephus was forged because you dont like what he said.
    You have zero evidence that any of his work was tampered with. There are no copies of his work that are any different than any others.
    So you make wild accusations such as his work being forged. But there is no evidence.
    If you dont like my blog dont read it.
    its not required.

    ReplyDelete
  24. Josephus did not live during Jesus' lifetime, and did not write the part about Jesus (if indeed he did write it) until later in life. So he was only repeating heresay.

    ReplyDelete
  25. YOu have no proof that he did not write the part about Jesus. That is my point.
    He was not my main evidence anyway.
    I showed you evidence. Historians alive at the time mentioned Jesus. THat is a historical fact. Deny all you want. Doesnt change the reality.
    The bible is a reliable witness as well. Just because people write about someone they like or believe in, does not make it invalid.
    That the bible was completely written by 80-90 a.d., is another historical fact. Easily proven.
    I still think you protest too much.
    If you really didnt believe, and were really not interested, you wouldnt be so interested.
    Look into it with an open mind.

    ReplyDelete
  26. You are still arguing that Jesus existed after I already told you I think a man named Jesus existed, I just don't believe he was the son of a supernatural god.

    Is that the whole basis of your faith? That a man named Jesus existed? Do you think that because a guy said he was the son of god that it was automatically true? David Koresh claimed to be the son of god as well.. do you believe him? There is more evidence that he existed than Jesus.

    You believe everything in the bible based on one man's life? When it was written by so many different men so many years after the fact?

    look into that with an open mind.

    ReplyDelete
  27. You said there was no evidence. I showed you evidence.
    Then, and now, you concede that there is evidence.
    THAT was the debate we were having.
    The choice of whether to belive he was the son of God and rose from the dead, .... is a choice we all can make.

    Look into that with an open mind.
    Ive also explained to you, and shown you, that the new testament was written within 50 years of the time of Jesus.
    And if you consider, it was written by several - many - different people, and it all fits together very well.

    You keep wanting to say i have no evidence, that i belive for no reason ... i think you should take a look at that ... why do you accuse me of that ?
    you know nothing about me.
    you know nothing of my reasons for faith.
    soooooooo ... what are you really saying to yourself?

    ReplyDelete
  28. You said there was no evidence. I showed you evidence. Then, and now, you concede that there is evidence. THAT was the debate we were having.

    We were not debating whether Jesus was a real person. I conceded that in my first post. We were debating the truth of the bible and the existence of god. Even conceding that Jesus was a real person, there is no proof he was the son of an all powerful god who created everything. Everything except itself. hmmm. who created god again? Oh yeah... man did!

    ReplyDelete
  29. who created god again? Oh yeah... man did!
    >
    You have no proof of that either. :)
    You can say i have no proof of God. i can say you have no proof that i am wrong.

    There is no way to prove, or disprove, the existence of God through scientific means.
    Its a different dimension.
    Philosophers have talked about the god question for thousands of years.
    what is physical is physical
    what is spirit is spirit
    you cant use one to measure the other.

    There are valid reasons to believe, from a logic and philosophical angle.
    There is also circumstantaial evidence.
    Millions of people over thousands of years have had the same subjective experience of God ...

    ReplyDelete
  30. They say you can tell a person's true self by how they act under stress. I guess we found out what kind of person James Jordan is.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Yea im so awful.
    I let you people rip me to shreds, say all sorts of nasty things about me, anonymously of course.
    I put my name on what i say on my own blog.
    But i let you anonymously criticize me for taking something off that i didnt like.
    I told him he could go back to that website and copy and paste it on here again.

    Im just so awful of a person though. I guess letting people post nasty things about me is just really uncool ...
    whatever people, if you dont like my blog dont read it.
    I have a right to allow, or not allow, anything i want on my blog.
    Go ahead and criticize some more,
    Ill put my name on this post.
    Which of you critics is man enough, or woman enough, to put your name on your post. Afraid ill look up your number in the phone book?

    ReplyDelete
  32. is that a threat? Very christian of you. Like anyone would fear your wrath anyway. haha

    ReplyDelete